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	<title>Comments on: Redder Than The Devil: Foreign Intervention Please</title>
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		<title>By: hobby</title>
		<link>http://absolutelybangkok.com/redder-than-the-devil-foreign-intervention-please/comment-page-1/#comment-3180</link>
		<dc:creator>hobby</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 08:03:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://absolutelybangkok.com/?p=3526#comment-3180</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;Reading&lt;/b&gt; won&#039;t help if you have a &lt;b&gt;closed&lt;/b&gt; mind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Reading</b> won&#8217;t help if you have a <b>closed</b> mind.</p>
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		<title>By: Global Voices Online &#187; Thailand: Revenge of the reds</title>
		<link>http://absolutelybangkok.com/redder-than-the-devil-foreign-intervention-please/comment-page-1/#comment-3179</link>
		<dc:creator>Global Voices Online &#187; Thailand: Revenge of the reds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 07:32:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://absolutelybangkok.com/?p=3526#comment-3179</guid>
		<description>[...] is disappointed that the red protesters are copying the tactics of the yellows: “The red shirts, attempting to [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] is disappointed that the red protesters are copying the tactics of the yellows: “The red shirts, attempting to [...]</p>
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		<title>By: David Brown</title>
		<link>http://absolutelybangkok.com/redder-than-the-devil-foreign-intervention-please/comment-page-1/#comment-3178</link>
		<dc:creator>David Brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 06:15:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://absolutelybangkok.com/?p=3526#comment-3178</guid>
		<description>Hi Andy ...

I have been &quot;involved,&quot; mostly from a distance, in Thai politics for 38 years, with background reading on history to back it up.

I dont think you should &quot;avoid&quot; the papers, in fact I read them all the time, it&#039;s just retain a heatlthy scepticism about any claimed facts, especially if repeated without any substantiation or against the evidence of our eyes ... e.g. PAD protests are unarmed and peaceful ... good phrase, but what does it mean?

Anyway, my aim in Thailand is to see a fully voted democratic governments in power ... democratically elected governments are accountable to the people, nominated MPs are only accountable to the elite or whatever group puts them in power.

As soon as a group feels it&#039;s in charge by nominating the MPs and government then they corrupt the system.

When MPs and governments are elected then the people are in charge.

Simple really ... and to date Thaksin&#039;s governments are the only ones that have been fully elected, and returned to the people to renew their mandate ... even if Thaksin was still here he would still be at risk every time there is an election ... and that&#039;s how it should be ... perform or you are out.

Now, who is Abhisit accountable to? Put into power by the military and the rich families ... I suppose as long as he keeps them happy he will be in power? 

Will this be good for the mass of the Thai people? 

Are they likely to feel empowered to better their lives?

Is Abhisit likely to do things that will make poor people feel they are not dominated by the rich?

Thailand needs democracy and democratically elected governments.

And, by the way, Thaksin&#039;s crime was to upset the established military and rich families ... and, as far as I can see all these mythical court cases against him are built on greed and envy, not fault.

And the land case, no, we think the courts bent the law, he was and is innocent of the charge! And his wife paid over the market price for the land ... have you seen the statement by a commercial land buyer who says he chose not to bid for the land because the price was too high ... so, who benefitted?

Anyway, I advise keep reading and thinking and where possible reviewing all the information you can get hold of ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Andy &#8230;</p>
<p>I have been &#8220;involved,&#8221; mostly from a distance, in Thai politics for 38 years, with background reading on history to back it up.</p>
<p>I dont think you should &#8220;avoid&#8221; the papers, in fact I read them all the time, it&#8217;s just retain a heatlthy scepticism about any claimed facts, especially if repeated without any substantiation or against the evidence of our eyes &#8230; e.g. PAD protests are unarmed and peaceful &#8230; good phrase, but what does it mean?</p>
<p>Anyway, my aim in Thailand is to see a fully voted democratic governments in power &#8230; democratically elected governments are accountable to the people, nominated MPs are only accountable to the elite or whatever group puts them in power.</p>
<p>As soon as a group feels it&#8217;s in charge by nominating the MPs and government then they corrupt the system.</p>
<p>When MPs and governments are elected then the people are in charge.</p>
<p>Simple really &#8230; and to date Thaksin&#8217;s governments are the only ones that have been fully elected, and returned to the people to renew their mandate &#8230; even if Thaksin was still here he would still be at risk every time there is an election &#8230; and that&#8217;s how it should be &#8230; perform or you are out.</p>
<p>Now, who is Abhisit accountable to? Put into power by the military and the rich families &#8230; I suppose as long as he keeps them happy he will be in power? </p>
<p>Will this be good for the mass of the Thai people? </p>
<p>Are they likely to feel empowered to better their lives?</p>
<p>Is Abhisit likely to do things that will make poor people feel they are not dominated by the rich?</p>
<p>Thailand needs democracy and democratically elected governments.</p>
<p>And, by the way, Thaksin&#8217;s crime was to upset the established military and rich families &#8230; and, as far as I can see all these mythical court cases against him are built on greed and envy, not fault.</p>
<p>And the land case, no, we think the courts bent the law, he was and is innocent of the charge! And his wife paid over the market price for the land &#8230; have you seen the statement by a commercial land buyer who says he chose not to bid for the land because the price was too high &#8230; so, who benefitted?</p>
<p>Anyway, I advise keep reading and thinking and where possible reviewing all the information you can get hold of &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: BangkokDan</title>
		<link>http://absolutelybangkok.com/redder-than-the-devil-foreign-intervention-please/comment-page-1/#comment-3177</link>
		<dc:creator>BangkokDan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 06:03:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://absolutelybangkok.com/?p=3526#comment-3177</guid>
		<description>I maintain &lt;em&gt;FrogBlogger&lt;/em&gt; that the lesser of two evils is still the better option for Thailand. Thaksin got his lessons and is still a maker, a man of action Abhisit is not.

Personally I&#039;d prefer Abhisit, but unfortunately he represents the greater of the two evils since we all know what happened these past weeks and months. Abhisit is no longer his own man.

That sounds dramatic, I know, but only his actions will prove us doubters wrong. And how I wish he proves us wrong!

&lt;a href=&quot;mailto:absolutelyBangkok@gmail.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;BangkokDan&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I maintain <em>FrogBlogger</em> that the lesser of two evils is still the better option for Thailand. Thaksin got his lessons and is still a maker, a man of action Abhisit is not.</p>
<p>Personally I&#8217;d prefer Abhisit, but unfortunately he represents the greater of the two evils since we all know what happened these past weeks and months. Abhisit is no longer his own man.</p>
<p>That sounds dramatic, I know, but only his actions will prove us doubters wrong. And how I wish he proves us wrong!</p>
<p><a href="mailto:absolutelyBangkok@gmail.com" rel="nofollow">BangkokDan</a></p>
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		<title>By: FrogBlogger</title>
		<link>http://absolutelybangkok.com/redder-than-the-devil-foreign-intervention-please/comment-page-1/#comment-3176</link>
		<dc:creator>FrogBlogger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 31 Dec 2008 05:06:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://absolutelybangkok.com/?p=3526#comment-3176</guid>
		<description>Don&#039;t know about Dan, but the suggestion that Thaksin is somehow a hero of democracy is rarely heard these days. On the contrary, most of the red movement leaders I spoke to in the north happily agreed that there was corruption, but were eager to point out that he certainly didn&#039;t hold the monopoly ... there were and are plenty of examples of extensive and systematic corruption on the other side of the political fence that the courts somehow miss - preferring to concentrate on politicians earning a few irrelevant baht from a dubious cookery talent, etc. The UDD is far more interested in a free and fair election, with as many international observers as it takes to ensure that manipulations are kept to a minimum, and at worst cancel each other out.

So the best solution? Free and fair, properly observed elections. The reds say that Abhisit is in office as a result of political trickery, and as a result until elections are held the feeling that the popular voice has been stifled just isn&#039;t going to go away.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t know about Dan, but the suggestion that Thaksin is somehow a hero of democracy is rarely heard these days. On the contrary, most of the red movement leaders I spoke to in the north happily agreed that there was corruption, but were eager to point out that he certainly didn&#8217;t hold the monopoly &#8230; there were and are plenty of examples of extensive and systematic corruption on the other side of the political fence that the courts somehow miss &#8211; preferring to concentrate on politicians earning a few irrelevant baht from a dubious cookery talent, etc. The UDD is far more interested in a free and fair election, with as many international observers as it takes to ensure that manipulations are kept to a minimum, and at worst cancel each other out.</p>
<p>So the best solution? Free and fair, properly observed elections. The reds say that Abhisit is in office as a result of political trickery, and as a result until elections are held the feeling that the popular voice has been stifled just isn&#8217;t going to go away.</p>
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		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://absolutelybangkok.com/redder-than-the-devil-foreign-intervention-please/comment-page-1/#comment-3172</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 18:14:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://absolutelybangkok.com/?p=3526#comment-3172</guid>
		<description>Apparently one point for you. 

Got your point, but be assured I read my way through the papers (not only The Nation or TOC).

BangkokPundit, to my point of view, is in the same way suspiciously one-sided as The Nation (was?). He hardly writes anything bad about the red side. No?

However maybe you can admit that The Nation, since the PAD took over the government building &amp; airports, has become also very critical of the PAD too.

They&#039;re not that one-sided anymore. 

I find The Nation actually quite accurate if I discuss/compare with my Thai Friends and compare with local media. They&#039;re as well not that extremely one-sided. 

Also the Bangkok Post was never a big fan of Thaksin since his law amendments and real priorities came to light. 

So in your point of view, The Nation and  Bangkok Post and other media have to be avoided and Thaksin is actually our real hero of democracy and not corrupt at all?

What is your possible best political solution for Thailand and Thaksin then? 

Anyhow I reckon we have to give Abhisit a chance.

Or are we just moving in circles?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apparently one point for you. </p>
<p>Got your point, but be assured I read my way through the papers (not only The Nation or TOC).</p>
<p>BangkokPundit, to my point of view, is in the same way suspiciously one-sided as The Nation (was?). He hardly writes anything bad about the red side. No?</p>
<p>However maybe you can admit that The Nation, since the PAD took over the government building &amp; airports, has become also very critical of the PAD too.</p>
<p>They&#8217;re not that one-sided anymore. </p>
<p>I find The Nation actually quite accurate if I discuss/compare with my Thai Friends and compare with local media. They&#8217;re as well not that extremely one-sided. </p>
<p>Also the Bangkok Post was never a big fan of Thaksin since his law amendments and real priorities came to light. </p>
<p>So in your point of view, The Nation and  Bangkok Post and other media have to be avoided and Thaksin is actually our real hero of democracy and not corrupt at all?</p>
<p>What is your possible best political solution for Thailand and Thaksin then? </p>
<p>Anyhow I reckon we have to give Abhisit a chance.</p>
<p>Or are we just moving in circles?</p>
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